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Whitelabel

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Dennis

We're working on a whitelabel version for companies to offer the Ploi panel to their customers under their own domain like:

https://ploi-core.io

Facts so far:

  • It will be self-hosted software, an advantage of it being self-hosted is that it GDPR proof (we will not know anything about your customers/data)
  • It will be fully white labelled, there are no traces of Ploi being used as a backend
  • The name of the product is "Ploi Core"
  • To use the software you will need a Ploi Core subscription, this is a standalone subscription which includes the Unlimited plan by default. Pricing will be announced in a later state.
  • The panel will also have a dark mode
  • Your customers will be able to use FTP (as it will install a FTP server on your server), in a later stadium the software will be able to serve FTPS optionally to increase security
  • All the websites are separated and isolated per customer and are unable to view/touch other customers sites
  • The Ploi Core panel is a very extensive panel with a lot of features available. Think about site management, administrators, built in support helpdesk for your customers and many more.
  • For the technical people, the panel is built with the following stack: Laravel, InertiaJS, VueJS, Vuex & TailwindCSS and it is using the Ploi API handle all your customers requests, including some Ploi Core specific API calls which are not available in the normal API
  • The panel will be multilingual (with launch EN and NL available, later more languages)
  • Updating Ploi Core will be a piece of cake, 1-click to update (literally a click on the button from the system itself)

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timjossund

excited to use this!


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Dennis

Status changed to: Live

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Nguyen Hoang Tung

It's 3rd Sept, any updates?


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Dennis

Yes, a statement is going out on our Twitter today 👏


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Leon Low

Has the launch been delayed? It has passed 22 August


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Dennis

Yes, it has been delayed, sadly. We did stated it was 'around 22 august', but sadly we were unable to reach this.

For now we've got it planned for the beginning of september.


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Ali

I have a small hosting busines with 40-50 clients. All my profit cant rach 299$/mo. This is big money for my country. I wait ploi whitelabel for a long time but when i see the pricing i'm disappointed. Why i waiting you? There is no webmail, no dns management, no billing system. Already i'm using cpanel whm with zero headache.. But i want to make a difference. I like this.
Please think about your pricing.


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Dennis

We've already changed pricing to to be determined.

However, if you have 40/50 clients, you should easily be able to reach 299$ a month, and even more actually.

I'd like to learn from your use-case. Can you tell me (or email if you want) how much you charge your clients for monthly?


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Ali

If you live in usa or europe, you're true. 50 clients will enough to make me a rich man :)
But in turkey, you cant sell 35/mo web hosting. Many big companies (guzel.net.tr, megatrhost, veridyen, hostlab, turhost, vargonen...) sells unlimited hosting packages $5-10$ per year not per month. I'm the most expensive among my competitors I charge 8$-15$/mo my clients. I have 4 servers 2 google cloud 1 upcloud, 1 digital ocean.


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boundless

Is there a clear comparison somewhere between the features available in Ploi and Ploi Core, besides it being self-hosted and whitelabel?


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Dennis

No, there is not, yet.


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Derin Tolu

This must be for established hosting companies only. The pricing doesnt support startup hosting. Take a look at what ServerPilot has done or WPMUdev is about to launch. Flexible scalable pricing should be a priority not an aftertgought. How many clients will you actually have busting down ur doors wanting to pay those prices? Frankly, not worth it. Why would anyone pay over $200 a month to whitelabel a control panel. Servers not included?? You should seriously do some better market research and get someone to price your product. The market value of the white label is maximum $20 - $25 on top of your normal rates. I doubt you will find anyone willing to pay more.


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Derin Tolu

Think aabout it this way. I want to offer hosting, why would I choose to pay $200 a month for your product when I can get Cloudron.io for example for $15 a month paid a year in advance. Completely white labeled, or Plesk at $30...Or ApisCP which is far more robust then all of the afore mentioned and can run circles around what u are preapred to offer is a mere $25. It could even be customized to interface with the PLOI API. So why would an agency spend that recrurring expense for a installable panel? Hope this helps.


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Dennis

Pricing is still in debate, will change, no worries :)


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boundless

I agree with @Derin Tolu. I'm having trouble understanding the rationale behind the pricing. Seems prohibitively expensive and it's unclear why self-hosting makes it 10 times more valuable. Maybe there's a roadmap and upcoming capabilities that make this more obvious, but given the current feature set, it doesn't make much sense to me.

I also don't understand the business model. Would my customers be expected to log in to Ploi Core? What would they do there? What kind of control would I have over what they can see (can I allow them to install only WordPress)? None of these capabilities exist in Ploi currently, so when would it be ready? 200 usd/mo is a lot for an unfinished product that doesn't offer so many essential features other self-hosted panels offer for less, at least when starting out.

I'd actually suggest going the other way. I'd consider open sourcing Ploi Core, encourage the community to contribute, offer *paid* support for the self-hosted version, and add proprietary services and features to the *hosted* version. Contributors can add features, implement additional hosting providers, add new types of apps and sites (i.e., Drupal, custom WordPress setups, other node or php apps, etc.), fix bugs, and more. You can even build an "app marketplace" of sorts, let people create new kinds of apps and providers, and take a fair cut.

This kind of approach would really differentiate Ploi from other panels and provide real competition for hosted panels like GridPane and RunCloud on the one hand and self-hosted panels like Plesk on the other. If you're already going down this road, this is a different business approach that's possibly technically not very different from your current direction.


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Dennis

I do agree on the pricing, I do not agree on open sourcing this. You have no idea what infrastructure is behind this to make this possible to run with Ploi, which I can't blame you on. But open-sourcing this is not a solution especially we had to expand our infrastructure massively for this to make this possible.

If you don't see a fit use-case for yourself, Ploi Core is not what you need. Its a side-product.

Ploi Core is especially targeted at hosting companies that want to provide a custom panel to their customers. Most freelancers won't be needing such a piece of software e.g. they can easily ignore this & just use Ploi itself.


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boundless

Apologies. I don't presume to know if it makes sense for you to open source Ploi Core. I suggested it based on the assumption that a self-hosted solution would require less of *your* infrastructure. Also, I wasn't trying to imply that *everything* should be open-sourced.

In any case, I think what's missing right now is more information about the capabilities of Ploi Core and how it differs from Ploi. It's very hard to make an informed decision based on what I currently know.

I'd also like to point out that the line between a freelancer and a hosting company is sometimes not very clearly defined. It's more about goals than structure. Smaller businesses want to grow...


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Derin Tolu

Also it’s quite unrealistic to treat email as if it doesn’t exist. I would come up with a solution even if it sucks for a while. Because email is a necessary evil and isn’t optional when building a “hosting company”.


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Dennis

I disagree, providing a 'hacky' solution to solve the email case is not a solution in my opinion.

We surely are working on it, but we are certainly not going to provide some temporary hacky solution to later write scripts to convert them or even worse; having them to reinstall the installation.

Also; I am not sure why you're getting the idea we are treating it as 'non existent'. We clearly write on the FAQ section about emailing.


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Juan Manuel Zolezzi Volpi

The service looks good, and the pricing is OK considering what's included.
At integration with WHMcs would make things great. A simple one, using native API, hopefully open source so it doesn't get lost or outdated.


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timjossund

My input would be is to come up with a co-branded option with the similar pricing to plesk, for smaller providers. Those prices are way to high for most small providers.


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Dennis

We are indeed looking at specific pricing for small companies and/or freelancers, since there is a market for that as well. We can't promise anything yet, though.


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Vinod Chacko

Do you have integrations for any billing module - like whmcs for example ?


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Dennis

We've actually been thinking about billing and are still open for idea's on integrations for this!

We are certainly seeing some great potential in billing module in the panel.


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TP

whmcs would be nice


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Dennis

Website is now open:

ploi-core.io


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Michael Giann

That pricing though. Guess small freelancers with 5-10 customers can't have the white label solution for them. Although looks great it defeats the purpose of having white label in ploi.io. The original concept was to have white label in ploi.io but now you have launched an entirely different service instead of adding it to ploi. Anyway. Hope you introduce other smaller and cheaper plans with limited servers or users but having white label.


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Dennis

Usually, small freelancers can work with ploi.io itself and do not require this 'bulk' feature.

This is what Ploi Core is focussed at, the bigger medium sized companies.


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Michael Giann

Yes but having white label is a good sign that our customers although little in number will appreciate it having their own panel. Also it will be a boost getting new customers if they see you provide them with that solution and afterwards we can upgrade to a bigger plan. You have eliminated completely the small size freelancers that want to grow big.


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Dennis

For now we do not have any plans to reduce pricing, certainly because I said before, Ploi Core is not ment for small freelancers, its a product for medium-sized to bigger companies where this kind of pricing is actually quite low.

If you're a small freelancer with 5-10 customers you're not even mostlikely need the ability to offer a webhosting panel to your customers since its a low number anyways.


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Dennis

3 exclusive facts for today:

- For the technical people, the panel is built with the following stack: Laravel, InertiaJS, VueJS, Vuex & TailwindCSS and it is using the Ploi API handle all your customers requests, including some Ploi Core specific API calls which are not available in the normal API

- The panel will be multilingual (with launch EN and NL available, later more languages)

- Updating Ploi Core will be a piece of cake, 1-click to update (literally a click on the button from the system itself)


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Dennis

3 exclusive facts for today:

- Your customers will be able to use FTP (as it will install a FTP server on your server), in a later stadium the software will be able to serve FTPS optionally to increase security

- All the websites are separated and isolated per customer and are unable to view/touch other customers sites

- The Ploi Core panel is a very extensive panel with a lot of features available. Think about site management, administrators, built in support helpdesk for your customers and many more.


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Dennis

Surprise fact 👀

- The panel will also have a dark mode


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Dennis

2 exclusive facts for today:

- The name of the product is "Ploi Core"

- To use the software you will need a Ploi Core subscription, this is a standalone subscription which includes the Unlimited plan by default. Pricing will be announced in a later state.


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Michael Giann

So anyone with Pro plan won't have the ability to use this even with a small extra fee?


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Dennis

To use Ploi Core, you will have to take a standalone subscription which includes the Unlimited plan automatically. You do not need any other subscriptions. Its only the Ploi Core subscription then.


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Sebastian Elpers

will there be a migrate function to switch from the current unlimited plan to the new ploi core?


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Dennis

There is no need, you just subscribe to Ploi Core and you're set. Your old subscription on whatever plan you had will be dropped, as the Ploi Core subscription comes with Unlimited automatically.

Nothing else changes for Ploi and or your account itself.


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Dennis

2 exclusive facts for today:

- It will be self-hosted software, an advantage of it being self-hosted is that it GDPR proof (we will not know anything about your customers/data)

- It will be fully white labelled, there are no traces of Ploi being used as a backend


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Boris Vera

Wow :D


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Mattylantz

I'm super excited about this


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Dimitris Thanasis Kakanis

Hello Dennis, finally! It will be a game changer for sure. Having Ploi self hosted has its cons too though. Definately GDPR compliance is important but how about updating and support? I would definitely love it a SaaS under a subscription.


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Dennis

Wait for tomorrow and this week, more unveils will happen about the facts of the software this week 🔥


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Dennis

Really small update:

We'll be giving away exclusive data about whitelabel next week in here, keep your eyes open! 🔥


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Ali

👀


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Dennis

👀


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Boris Vera


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Dennis

All I can say, keep a close eye on this card... Things are happening, and real soon as well... 🔥

(And it's even more awesome than we predicted)


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Boris Vera

whoo-hoo!


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DS

+1


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Juanzo Lezzi

Hopefully this allows to configure different Cloudflare accounts, one for each client.


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Peter Kuipers

+1 for this


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Boris Vera

Any news?


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Boris Vera

Waiting impatiently 🤞


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Sean Hynes

Awesome well done!~ Let me know if need beta testers on a fresh server for my Dev Server. Will do it


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tom 83

How long will that be available?


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Dennis

We hope to release around april.


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Vivek Prism

Need this hope you are able to put more time on this during this global lockdown Need this


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Vivek Prism

Need desperately


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Dimitris Thanasis Kakanis

Ploi could become a great alternative to Plesk, cpanel etc.. The White label option along with the permissions feature will let people create their own hosting business. Personally I would pay premium for this.
Serverpilot team develops hostlaunch.io which focuses solely on digitalocean droplets. It's kind of restrictive.
To my eyes there is a big niche interested in a control panel made for the cloud in contrast to the legacy apps I mentioned above. I'm realy looking forward to see what Dennis and his team mates will bring to the table!


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Vivek Prism

need that


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Dennis

We're working on it, hopefully pricing & release in april 👏


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taavip

Can't wait :)


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Ali

Bump :)


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tom 83

Waiting for this one!


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Dennis

Would like to know your use case :)


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Dennis

Status changed to: In progress